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Path: euryale.cc.adfa.oz.au!newshost.carno.net.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!munnari.OZ.AU!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!news.wildstar.net!news.ececs.uc.edu!newsfeeds.sol.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!panix!news.panix.com!not-for-mail From: tls@panix.com (Thor Lancelot Simon) Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc,comp.unix.bsd.netbsd.misc,comp.unix.bsd.openbsd.misc,comp.unix.bsd.misc,comp.unix.bsd.386bsd.misc Subject: Re: *BSD Unification? Date: 3 Apr 1997 16:21:59 -0500 Organization: Panix Lines: 54 Message-ID: <5i171n$erp@panix2.panix.com> References: <860029226.1885@dejanews.com> <5hvj0g$gvj@panix2.panix.com> <5i0e9j$1qc$1@daily.bbnplanet.com> <3343CF60.1CFBAE39@FreeBSD.org> Reply-To: tls@rek.tjls.com NNTP-Posting-Host: panix2.panix.com X-Newsposter: trn 4.0-test55 (26 Feb 97) Xref: euryale.cc.adfa.oz.au comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:38363 comp.unix.bsd.netbsd.misc:5734 comp.unix.bsd.openbsd.misc:47 comp.unix.bsd.misc:2934 comp.unix.bsd.386bsd.misc:1213 In article <3343CF60.1CFBAE39@FreeBSD.org>, Jordan K. Hubbard <jkh@FreeBSD.org> wrote: >David Todd wrote: >> >> So now it's not "appropriate to discuss in public". >> >> Yeah, that'll help. >> >> Maybe it is time to look at Linux... > >Perhaps Thor needs a little coaching in better public presentation, but >I think his fundamental point was valid (if perhaps not for the reasons >you think). The reason it's not a *practical* subject to discuss in >public (appropriate was, IMHO, the wrong word to use) is the fact that >it never gets us anywhere, and we've had plenty of experience with the >topic. We get 4 or 5 impassioned pleas for reason, written by various >naieve yet sincere folk, 50 messages asking what our friggin' problem is >and why we don't just unify *right now*, another 40 or so smug >I-told-you-so messages from other OS camps, using the opportunity to >trot out their usual theories about how this all means that *BSD is dead >dead dead, I just don't see the point of going through that Yet Again! Yeah, what he said. :-) Seriously, if you think that I'm scared because you think that "Maybe it is time to look at Linux" because I personally don't think that we're going to get anywhere discussing this particular topic in public, you...are misled. I've been in the thick of this issue a couple of times. I trust the people involved. If it is ever sensible, productive, and feasible to merge the various BSD projects, I am certain that that will occur. However, rehashing the whole thing in public doesn't ever get anyone anywhere; the people who would, after all, end up having to work closely together for months if not years to make this happen, and presumably thereafter, essentially have to agree among themselves that it's worth doing and that they want to do it, and essentially no amount of external pressure is going to cause that. It's like pushing me and my little sister together in the back seat of the car at age six and screaming "Get Along, damn you!". I'm glad my parents didn't ever try that. People _learn_ to work with each other and respect each other, even people who already agree on many issues. That takes time, and it also isn't a process which generally works well in public. I mean, discuss whatever you like, but as I said, I don't think it will effect much change. That doesn't mean that the change you want to see won't happen, but it may mean that by beating the subject to death, you might be able to make everyone involved sick of talking about it, and then it might not happen at least partially because of _you_. Think it over, okay? -- Thor Lancelot Simon tls@rek.tjls.com Most things do not correlate with actual behavior. -George Conklin